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Radio Times met up with renowned chef Marco Pierre White as he took over at the helm of ITV1's Hell's Kitchen back in September 2007. However, Jenny Eden's interview didn't quite go to plan…
Marco Pierre White: This is my son Luciano.
Jenny Eden: You're teaching him all the tricks of the trade, then.
He knows enough tricks of his own.
His father's son, then.
OK, then.
What persuaded you to do a TV show because I read a few years ago that it was something that you said you never wanted to do?
You must remember when I cooked and I had three stars in Michelin to defend, I couldn't question my integrity by leaving my kitchen by taking the time out to do a programme or a series for a TV company, because it meant I had left people in charge of my establishment. It means people are charging high prices to come to my restaurant for me to do the cooking and I'm not there. I think it is very wrong.
Did you have any doubts about TV?
Not really. What was important to me was winning three stars in the Michelin, retaining three stars in the Michelin with my integrity intact.
What about now?
Now I haven't cooked for eight years.
Do you miss running a kitchen?
No. The only time you miss something is when you haven't replaced it with anything. So even something as simple as a relationship you separate from your partner you will miss that person or certain aspects of that person at least until you replace that person with somebody else.
(phone pings, he checks mobile)
So was there anything at this point that made you decide to do a TV show?
I liked the show. Secondly, I now have the time now to do it and the want to do it. And as I have said if it is not interesting, educational, inspirational then I'm not interested in doing the show because I believe you use TV as a vehicle to deliver a message.
How will your version be different from the previous two versions of the series?
I'm not there to belittle people. I am there to inspire and guide people.
Isn't that what part of the audience tunes in for, to see celebrities having a hard time?
Depends on the individual, doesn't it? Firstly I'd like to see an insight into how a professional kitchen is run. Secondly, I would like to see food. Thirdly I would like to see how people progress. I do accept there will be moments where people will be told off. I accept that. It's like any line of business. If you didn't deliver your copy on time your editor would be on the phone to you screaming and shouting. If I didn't deliver a plate of food when the chef has called it away in time he is going to shout at me. That is the world we live in.
Do you think you have mellowed over the years, do you think your volume and ability to shout has moderated in any way?
That's for everyone to wait and see, isn't it? Including myself.
Do you think you will surprise yourself, then?
In which sense?
In how you handle it.
I'm not there to surprise myself. I'm not there to surprise anybody. I am there to do a job and feed 75 people a night for three weeks.
Are there any celebrities you wouldn't take on?
I have no say in that. It's not my show. I am one link within the chain like anybody else.
What do you think of what you have seen before on previous series?
It's a one-dimensional concept…well the concept is not one-dimensional, the individuals who were in Hell's Kitchen I felt were one-dimensional.
will you be aiming to get someone who is a good cook out of it?
I'm not there to teach people to cook, I am there to inspire people and to make people want to cook. To be a great cook comes from within you. No-one can teach you to cook, they can inspire you, but it's up to you yourself to want to do it.
Do you watch any celebrity chefs on TV?
No.
Not even out of curiosity?
No. There are more interesting programmes on TV.
You're not interested in any of them at all?
The only person I think delivers anything with intergrity is Hugh Fearnley-Whittingstall.
Why is that?
He is romantic, he has integrity, he is intelligent, he shows you the providence (sic) of food. OK, the chink within his armour is he's not a great cook.
Do you think it is one of the reasons people go off to be TV cooks because they can't cut it in the kitchen?
No, I think it's the best way they can make money. You can't knock someone like Jamie Oliver because he makes a living the best way he can. You can't knock Ainsley Harriot because he makes money the best way he can. You can't criticise them because whether you like the show or not is an irrelevance but some people must. And you have to respect people how they earn their money. We all have children we have a duty to provide security for our children, food on their table and a roof over their heads.
Have your kids seen you at work in the kitchen?
No. Luciano and his brother Marco used to come and sit on the pass from 11:45am to 12 every day when they were younger. But I don't remember whether they remember seeing their father in the kitchen.
(Luciano grins and nods)
Have you taught them to cook?
No.
Would you like them to follow you into that line?
It's their choice. For me to want my son to follow me would be me being egotistical. It's down to them to want to follow me, not for me to force them into business. Young boys and girls today have so many more options than I did when I was a boy their age.
You learnt from your dad when you were very young, didn't you?
I learnt from necessity and also by contributing to the family because my mother died when I was six. It wasn't my wish or my choice.
But you obviously have a talent in you from your father?
I have a natural appreciation for mother nature.
And that's something…
I think that anyone who is truly a great cook at whatever level has an automatic respect for mother nature because of what mother nature represents. You have to respect your produce. You have to buy great produce. If you do that you are halfway there to creating great food.
In the past you said you used Knorr in your kitchen - did that come up with a sponsorship deal for you?
There's nothing wrong with Knorr. It's like there is nothing wrong with HP or ketchup. Let's be honest, an English breakfast without HP is not an English breakfast. A ham sandwich without English mustard is not a ham sandwich. Fish and chips without malt vinegar are not fish and chips. It is very simple: you make ten pints of mushroom soup. You put five pints in one pan, five in the other pan, season one with salt and pepper, season one with Knorr, tell me which tastes better. Eating is all about enjoyment and eating food is what it's meant to taste of. Knorr is a necessity within every kitchen. And Knorr is more forgiving than salt. You over-salt something, it's finished. You put a bit too much Knorr in, you can rectify it.
So they didn't send you a lifetime's supply of stock cubes?
Their sales went up 27 per cent when I said what I said in the Hotel and Caterer as a throwaway line. Well, it wasn't a throwaway line, it was a serious line. I used Knorr on Sunday making the gravy. In a domestic kitchen, do you have stock, do you have this, do you have that, no, you don't. We have a cupboard and we all tend to have Knorr or Oxo in our cupboard right or wrong. You try and make gravy with water and no Knorr cube or stock cube and you can't. It's fantastic. Unless you want to have Bisto. Bisto is not my big.
How normally do you eat at home? Do you eat beans on toast or that kind of thing?
No, I don't like baked beans.
Have you got a guilty pleasure - is there any kind of fast food that you like?
As I've said, McDonalds. When I've finished stalking [hunting] about 7:30 in the morning, what are my options 100 miles away from London? I've been up since 3am and I've had little sleep. I get an Egg McMuffin and a cup of tea from McDonalds I'm over the moon. There's a time and a place for everything. And let's not be narrow minded. When I drive into the Moto station, what are my options? Have you had a McDonalds? Well, you're missing out. If I'm driving back from Bournemouth with my children in the car on a Sunday night and the motorway is jammed and my daughter is crying in the back because she's hungry, what's wrong with six chicken popcorns? Let's live in the real world, the modern world.
So you're not here to change anybody's eating habits?
I'm not here to educate people. I'm not. If anything I'm here to inspire them. I hate food snobs.
What gives you your buzz these days now you aren't in the kitchen?
I'm forever doing many things. I do books, I just finished my autobiography, I've just finished the Hells Kitchen book, I'm just about to go into Hell's Kitchen, I'm about to open a restaurant in Chelsea, I'm about to open in Dubai next week, I just opened in Shanghai, I'm about to do a restaurant on P&O ships - The White Room - I am working on a deal in Vegas, in Beijing, in Abu Dhabi, in Ireland, Sandbanks. And if I was in the kitchen I couldn't do any of those things.
Does the business side of it give you as much excitement as being in the kitchen?
I like doing things. I just like doing things. It doesn't matter what I'm doing, I like doing things, I like working. It doesn't matter if I'm in a kitchen or not.
America seems to be the next obvious step - is that the idea behind the Las Vegas restaurant?
It's not an obvious step, it's an opportunity. You see, I don't think let's move on to the next level, what I look at is opportunities, I'm an opportunist, as I say I like doing things.
Do you cook at home?
No, I don't cook at home, I don't need to. I have got a load of restaurants.
You must do things like breakfast?
Breakfast is breakfast, we don't eat cooked breakfast. Luciano this morning had a bacon and egg sandwich. I like going out.
Do you have high standards..?
That's quite a silly question really.
In terms of…
No, think about what you just said. Don't smudge the issue? What do you think? Did you check the cuttings?
Of course.
And did that highlight I have high standards? I think we should end this interview now, thank you very much, have a nice day. There's your tape recorder. Don't insult me.
I didn't mean it in that way.
Don't insult me.
I meant in terms…
It's like me saying are you a good journalist?
I meant…
Go.
I meant in terms of cooking with your family.
Now you are insulting me and my family.
I apologise if you think I am, but if you would let me explain…
I'd accept your apology if I thought you meant it. But you don't. You're the worst journalist I've ever met. Go. The interview is over. You are insulting me. I wish you luck with your career with the Radio Times but sometimes northerners should stay in the north.
I'm from the Midlands.
Same thing.
Jenny Eden: Next day Marco's autobiography The Devil in the Kitchen was delivered to me with a hand written note "To Jenny, very sorry for not been (sic) the gentleman I should have been. Apologies. Marco".
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